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View Poll Results: What You Recommend?
Bridgestone Potenza RE970 AS Pole Position (Utra High Performance All-Season) 1 8.33%
Michelin Pilot Sport A/S Plus (Utra High Performance All-Season) 5 41.67%
Michelin Primacy MXM4 Grand Touring All Season 4 33.33%
Pirelli P Zero Nero All Season (Utra High Performance All-Season) 2 16.67%
Pirelli P Zero Nero M+S All Season ((Utra High Performance All-Season) 0 0%
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      03-26-2013, 01:24 PM   #1
Tracus
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Best Non-RFT All Season Tires for X1

Ok,
So I have decided to buy a set of M wheels for my X1.
My X1 came equiped with 17" 318 style. I like them, quite a lot actualy, but it is painful for me to wash them as I want.

So today I have ordered the 18" 355 M double-spoke wheels. Since I do not intend to swap them during the winter (because I hate taking wheels to the dealership and destroy my interior), I ordered four front wheels 8 J x 18.
In this way I can use them for summer and winter as well. Tire rotation can be done as well, however, BMW X1 is a 50:50 balanced vehicle so I don't think I need to do that anyway.

Now I need to find the best compromise tire for my wheels. I am looking for the best All-Season tire that will handle summer, rain and winter in good conditions. I am in Canada and we do get good snow in here, however, I am not a rookie driver, nor my wife, if the tire is a good one I don't see a problem. My ex AWD Jaguar was equiped with Michellin Primacy MXV4 All-Season and I never got stucked with the car. Ever.

The RFT are hard with a not very confy ride, heavy and very expensive. I took one screw last week and one tire cost me $530 to replace. I bought it so I can run well and sell the old wheels properly to the buyer, but I think I am done with RFT.

I have looked on Tire Rack and I found that the most used are:

* Bridgestone Potenza RE970 AS Pole Position (Utra High Performance All-Season)

* Michelin Pilot Sport A/S Plus (Utra High Performance All-Season)

* Michelin Primacy MXM4 Grand Touring All Season

* Pirelli P Zero Nero All Season (Utra High Performance All-Season)

* Pirelli P Zero Nero M+S All Season ((Utra High Performance All-Season)


If you guys switched to Non RFT tires, please let me know what you choose and why.

Thanks
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Last edited by Tracus; 03-26-2013 at 01:43 PM.
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      03-26-2013, 01:32 PM   #2
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We ran our previous 135i on Pilot A/S since my M Coupe was on PSS and we needed one car that could get around in the snow. It wasn't ideal, but it was passable provided you left room around you. X Drive will help a little with getting going, but of course won't change the nature of stopping. They were a very minor step down from the OE Bridgestone summer tires in terms of absolute grip, but the ride was so much better and it had a more predictable handling characteristic after the change. I only wish Michelin would update the rather old design of the Pilot A/S. Of your listed tires, I think I'd choose the Pirelli for the best summer traction.

Oops, looks like the Bridgestone might be your best bet:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/...y.jsp?ttid=165
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      03-26-2013, 01:40 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Bread View Post
.. Of your listed tires, I think I'd choose the Pirelli for the best summer traction.

Oops, looks like the Bridgestone might be your best bet:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/...y.jsp?ttid=165
How was the Pirelli on snow?
In the test they didn't include any Michelin?
I admit, I am leaning towards Michelin due to my past experience...

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      03-26-2013, 01:52 PM   #4
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Sorry, I haven't driven the P Zero Neros. My only recent experience is the Pilot A/S and the P7 Cintuaro RFT's on our X1. The Pilot A/S were pretty good in the snow, the 255 rears were a little less predictable than the 225 fronts, I still hate the staggered approach BMW loves, but without an LSD, non M cars would be crippled without it.

My Pilot Super Sports were comically bad in temps under 40, snow didn't really make them any worse the few times I ventured out in it, but just the cold temps alone made them squirrelly as hell. I have had great experience with Michelin though and never had a good experience with Bridgestone's, so I'd likely choose the Pilot A/S again if I needed another tire. It's a shame the Pilot A/S N-Spec comes in such limited sizing, it looks like a promising compromise and is the Panamera all season tire.
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      03-26-2013, 01:56 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Bread View Post
Sorry, I haven't driven the P Zero Neros. My only recent experience is the Pilot A/S and the P7 Cintuaro RFT's on our X1. The Pilot A/S were pretty good in the snow, the 255 rears were a little less predictable than the 225 fronts, I still hate the staggered approach BMW loves, but without an LSD, non M cars would be crippled without it.

My Pilot Super Sports were comically bad in temps under 40, snow didn't really make them any worse the few times I ventured out in it, but just the cold temps alone made them squirrelly as hell. I have had great experience with Michelin though and never had a good experience with Bridgestone's, so I'd likely choose the Pilot A/S again if I needed another tire. It's a shame the Pilot A/S N-Spec comes in such limited sizing, it looks like a promising compromise and is the Panamera all season tire.
I am actualy playing with the ideea of trying the Michelin Pilot A/S. They seem a litle bit more money than MXM4 so I guess they are better.
I don't have a good experinece with Bridgestone neither...
And yes, we do get -45 sometimes, they better work under 40 (Celsius)
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      03-26-2013, 01:59 PM   #6
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Curious, what's your plan if you do get a flat with a non-RFT?
I am considering getting non-RFT's for my winter rims, but I have a buddy mechanic
that could fetch my summer tire to get me going again in case of a flat.
Although, changing a flat in the winter could totally suck, especially if its cold, and snowing out.
So, I'm not sure what to do yet.
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      03-26-2013, 02:12 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stonex1 View Post
Curious, what's your plan if you do get a flat with a non-RFT?
I am considering getting non-RFT's for my winter rims, but I have a buddy mechanic
that could fetch my summer tire to get me going again in case of a flat.
Although, changing a flat in the winter could totally suck, especially if its cold, and snowing out.
So, I'm not sure what to do yet.
Just my experience, in two comically warmer climates, Texas and Southern California. I had my M Coupe (without RFT's or a spare) for a dozen years and had one catastrophic tire failure that required a tow. I plugged a few slow flats and then had them properly patched before tracking it again, but the one blow out was a poorly mounted, heavily tracked Toyo that I knew was a problem, it had a bubble in the sidewall, but I kept driving it. Stupid.

My point is it's relatively unlikely you'll ever be caught with a sudden flat. With TPMS (my M Coupe didn't have it) you'll be hard pressed to miss a slow flat, and blowouts are extremely uncommon with quality tires. If you carry a plug kit (and know how to use it) you can fix most flats, and even without it, most flats allow you plenty of time to get by a tire shop and have it properly patched from the inside. One other point, even with the RFT's, it worth having a jack and lug wrench around, something BMW leaves out of current cars.
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      03-26-2013, 02:15 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stonex1 View Post
Curious, what's your plan if you do get a flat with a non-RFT?
I am considering getting non-RFT's for my winter rims, but I have a buddy mechanic
that could fetch my summer tire to get me going again in case of a flat.
Although, changing a flat in the winter could totally suck, especially if its cold, and snowing out.
So, I'm not sure what to do yet.
I was under the same dilema for a while now.
But, RFT are harsh, heavy, and very expensive. I paid for one RFT the price of two NonRFT. And I was lucky I don't have too many miles on the car. They said I am still ok buying only one. But if I need to buy two? Here it goes over $1000, right? And I don't intend to buy two only, I always buy a nice new set, I am very considerate with my cars. I mean, I run them until 50% and then buy a new set.
Not to mention, all my life I never got a flat. It might be bad luck but I do believe that RFT are not that elastic and more prone to flats.

Bottom line, I think I will have a better ride, quietter for sure, it will be easy for the car to spin a less heavier tire and probably even my gas consumption will go a litle bit down. Who knows...
However, I bought a Mobility Kit from BMW. I don't know if it works but I have it. For long trips, I intend to order that donut that some people get, put it in the trunk, and God Help Me.

RFT are not good on a long run anyway. If you get a flat, you need to run at a certain speed (which is ok) but a certain number of km. If after that I am lucky enough to reach a tire shop, I will have the surprize to find out that they don't carry RFT because they are rare and special order. In a big city, even the dealer had only one in stock that was actually waiting for another customer and they gave it to me, because that guy suposed to come in three days later. One tire in stock! Otherwise 4 days waiting! And yes, it cost me $530!

Bottom line, there is a risk anyway, but at least I am takink the one with more options and a better ride.

PS
And one more thing: this GoodYear RFT tire is the single one that really mess up my garage, always leaves black marks on the floor and I hate cleaning that.

Last edited by Tracus; 03-26-2013 at 02:26 PM.
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      03-26-2013, 02:25 PM   #9
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I put 143k miles on a car with no RFT's and lived to tell about. That included a few 2k+ mile trips. I will recommend that you never use the sealant in the BMW kit, it's a real mess once you get it on the wheel and tire shops will call you names. Best to just avoid it.

My wife put about 25k miles on the 1er with non RFT's without ever be stranded. That car was transformed by removing the RFT's. I think the generation on our X1's are a lot better, but if you're looking for the best ride and handling, you will absolutely benefit from losing the RFT's.
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      03-26-2013, 02:28 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Bread View Post
I put 143k miles on a car with no RFT's and lived to tell about. That included a few 2k+ mile trips. I will recommend that you never use the sealant in the BMW kit, it's a real mess once you get it on the wheel and tire shops will call you names. Best to just avoid it.

My wife put about 25k miles on the 1er with non RFT's without ever be stranded. That car was transformed by removing the RFT's. I think the generation on our X1's are a lot better, but if you're looking for the best ride and handling, you will absolutely benefit from losing the RFT's.
Thank you for your input. yes, I need to improve the ride. I like chewing gum, however, not all the time.
If the BMW mobility kit is not good, what should I use then?
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      03-26-2013, 03:38 PM   #11
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That's funny ... I literally just returned from picking up my all-seasons. I went with the Continental ExtremeContact DWS. My primary considerations were ride comfort, treadwear and dry handling. The DWS is better than most all-seasons in the snow, too, although that's not as important to me since I have a dedicated winter wheel and tire package. Although I have the staggered setup and therefore don't have as many tire choices, I likely would have chosen the DWS's anyway.

Unfortunately, the tire shop damaged one of my wheels. It's purely cosmetic, so I'm going to bolt them on Thursday anyway until they can get me a replacement. I'll be logging roughly 1,200 miles on the new tires over the holiday weekend, so I'll know very soon if they make a noticeable difference in ride comfort.

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires...20Sport%20Line

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests...y.jsp?ttid=165
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      03-26-2013, 03:43 PM   #12
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These Continental look like The Nokian, half/half. Interesteing. never thought of them... Nokian Maybe?
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      03-26-2013, 03:46 PM   #13
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I used Bridgestone Potenza RE970 on my last car, it handle great yet very comfortable. Wet performance is also superior. The only downside is the mpg, I lose 2mpg+ compare to my old tires.
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      03-26-2013, 03:50 PM   #14
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I just got the RE970's too and noticed about the same thing. MPG seems to be down about 1 to 2 mpg, but that might improve. Ride quality is slightly better. Wet traction is a ton better. Keep in mind I have a '07 328 without sport package. Later model years made the suspension softer, and the RE970's might be more comfortable with those.
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      03-26-2013, 06:30 PM   #15
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Hmm, so you guys like the Bridgestone.
Anybody tried the Michelin MXM4? Or the Nokian WRG2?
Nokians are coming through different dealers, not available at tirerack.

http://www.nokiantires.com/tyre?id=1...me=Nokian+WRG2
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      03-26-2013, 06:30 PM   #16
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If you look at the Tire Rack winter road tests, the Potenza 970s don't do so well in snow: http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/...r.jsp?ttid=147

I previously had Potenza 960s and was satisfied with dry and wet performance. We recently got new tires (road debris destroyed our tires) for our 128i and ended up with Continental ExtremeContact DWS. I wanted 970s but Bridgestone doesn't build them in the right fitment for our 128i (we don't need snow performance).

I preferred the steering feel of our previous tires (Hankook V12) but haven't really tested the DWS out on any curves yet.

Since you get snow and Continental is not a choice I will vote Pirelli.
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      03-26-2013, 06:35 PM   #17
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Quote:
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Since you get snow and Continental is not a choice I will vote Pirelli.

HottRodW is using Continental and he seems happy...

Difficult choice...
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      03-26-2013, 09:26 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracus View Post
Hmm, so you guys like the Bridgestone.
Anybody tried the Michelin MXM4? Or the Nokian WRG2?
Nokians are coming through different dealers, not available at tirerack.

http://www.nokiantires.com/tyre?id=1...me=Nokian+WRG2
I put MXM4's on my Subaru. Quiet, comfortable, long-wearing tires, but less performance-oriented than the others you're considering. FWIW, I believ the Primacy MXM4 is the OE tire for the Acura RDX.

I considered the WRG2 a few years ago after being blown away by the Nokian winter tires I put on my wife's Audi. The reviews I read, mostly European, were consistently positive. I do recall one negative being relatively short tread life. In the end I elected to pass because of availability concerns. The closest dealer was over an hour away, and the tires weren't stocked, so emergency replacements would always be a few days away.
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      03-26-2013, 09:42 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracus View Post
HottRodW is using Continental and he seems happy...

Difficult choice...
One thing I like about the Conti DWS is that it has a very unique tread pattern with D, W and S letter indicators. When the S wears away, you know that you only have Dry and Wet performance remaining. After the W wears away, it's time to start thinking about replacing.
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      03-26-2013, 09:53 PM   #20
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Best All-Season tires 2012 in conformity with auto123.com
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      03-29-2013, 10:33 AM   #21
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So, from all people in here just five are using non RFT?

Common guys, bring your vote, I need to see what are you running...
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      03-29-2013, 10:37 AM   #22
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Michelin Pilot Sport AS here...set up square. I use them as my winter set. I'd get them again and again
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