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      10-15-2017, 09:26 AM   #1
hardparker
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F-series 340mm Brembos on X1

My wife picked up a nice, super low mileage X1 that sat unused, outside near lake Michigan in the winters, with the rotors slowly rusting away. The rest of the car is pretty much rust free, but take a look at the nasty before pic of the front brakes. Even after months of use, the pad didn't make contact with the outer 1/2" of the rotor where it had rusted away. The rest of the rotor wasn't much better. When the rear pads warned they were low, it was time for an upgrade.

The rears got OEM equivalent rotors and EBC YellowStuff pads. The fronts got a nice set of used 435i Brembo calipers, which I painted Valencia Orange to match the car, new Centric 340mm slotted and dimpled rotors, StopTech braided stainless lines, and EBC YellowStuff pads as well. I picked up the calipers from a junk yard online. It was $290 shipped for 2016 435i calipers with 13,000 miles!

The whole brake job, front and rear, with parts and supplies, was a measly $700, including the cost of the calipers. Pretty cheap for a decent brake setup. It stops harder and feels better. I'm happy with my handy work and the wife is happy with her fancy new brakes.
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      10-15-2017, 09:41 AM   #2
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Looks great!

Couple of comments/questions:

Did you check on the piston diameters (in view of the increased rotor diameter) to see if you were significantly shifting brake bias front or rear compared to stock?

While people do daily EBC yellows, I find their cold bite pretty bad. They really are a "light" track pad. Maybe in your warm climate it wouldn't be too big of a deal, but I much prefer the reds on a daily.
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      10-15-2017, 10:22 AM   #3
hardparker
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Originally Posted by PrematureApex View Post
Looks great!

Couple of comments/questions:

Did you check on the piston diameters (in view of the increased rotor diameter) to see if you were significantly shifting brake bias front or rear compared to stock?

While people do daily EBC yellows, I find their cold bite pretty bad. They really are a "light" track pad. Maybe in your warm climate it wouldn't be too big of a deal, but I much prefer the reds on a daily.
Thanks. I'm fairly certain the braking was heavily rear biased before, since the pads wore out at the rear in just over 20,000 miles. It feels more front biased now, I'd say. There's certainly more fluid volume up front in those four piston calipers.

I've daily driven EBC Greens, Reds and Yellows over the years on various cars. I far prefer the Yellows in all circumstances and find they have excellent cold bite. Superior to the Reds in my opinion, and IIRC, their cold coefficient of friction is actually higher than the Reds. It's kind of hard finding the technical docs on their site anymore, but I think the Yellows are like .63 and the Reds a little less.
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      10-15-2017, 02:15 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hardparker View Post
Thanks. I'm fairly certain the braking was heavily rear biased before, since the pads wore out at the rear in just over 20,000 miles. It feels more front biased now, I'd say. There's certainly more fluid volume up front in those four piston calipers
The rears wearing faster than the fronts is very common in these cars with the "e-diff" constantly working the brakes. Completely reverses the typical -fronts where 2x as quickly as the rear-. Certainly don't look to pad wear as any indication of front or rear bias. If anything, a stock setup is going to be relatively more front biased vs. a more aggressive setup. Case in point, many front Brembo BBKs actually provide LESS clamping force than OEM calipers in order to shift some bias rearward, improving overall braking performance, reducing dive, etc.

Fluid volume has nothing to do with anything (sans some heat capacity on the track), you needed to look at total piston area. Again, plenty of 4 or 6 piston calipers actually provide less stopping power than factory sliders, by design. As far as stopping power goes, piston count is also not relevant.

As mentioned above, if you shifted bias forward (as you think you did), you actual HURT your stopping distances. Generally, the OE setup is overly front-biased for stability, despite the fact that the rear tires have a bit more traction left to give, particularly in the dry. If you gave it MORE front, while it might feel like you're stopping faster, you're giving up even more available rear traction, and actually hurt your maximum braking performance.

Point is, while I'm sure they're fine...there's a fair amount to consider (and to understand) before simply swapping rotors and calipers from another car onto one axle, and expecting improved performance.

Regarding the red stuff vs. yellow stuff, the yellowstuff's minimum working temp is a whole 100 degrees higher than the reds. Nominal friction coefficients aside (which applies to their rated working range), it's pretty well-documented about the yellowstuff's lack of cold temp bite (again, that may not apply to you). I do see they upgraded the compound somewhat recently, so maybe my experience with them in winter almost 10 years ago is dated. But Yellowstuff on a 15 degree morning backing down a driveway has been an eye-opener for quite a few of us. Not a huge deal once you adjust for them...but yeah...certainly lacking cold bite particularly compared to OEM pads, which are famous for their initial grab. Even a cursory google search reveals plenty of reviews stating the same.
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      10-15-2017, 07:24 PM   #5
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Good to know I just got a set and they are at the powder coats now. I was thinking of doing to rears also. Their is a guy on here that as the 370 m sport front and rear brakes on his x1.
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      10-19-2017, 10:57 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PrematureApex View Post
The rears wearing faster than the fronts is very common in these cars with the "e-diff" constantly working the brakes. Completely reverses the typical -fronts where 2x as quickly as the rear-. Certainly don't look to pad wear as any indication of front or rear bias. If anything, a stock setup is going to be relatively more front biased vs. a more aggressive setup. Case in point, many front Brembo BBKs actually provide LESS clamping force than OEM calipers in order to shift some bias rearward, improving overall braking performance, reducing dive, etc.

Fluid volume has nothing to do with anything (sans some heat capacity on the track), you needed to look at total piston area. Again, plenty of 4 or 6 piston calipers actually provide less stopping power than factory sliders, by design. As far as stopping power goes, piston count is also not relevant.

As mentioned above, if you shifted bias forward (as you think you did), you actual HURT your stopping distances. Generally, the OE setup is overly front-biased for stability, despite the fact that the rear tires have a bit more traction left to give, particularly in the dry. If you gave it MORE front, while it might feel like you're stopping faster, you're giving up even more available rear traction, and actually hurt your maximum braking performance.

Point is, while I'm sure they're fine...there's a fair amount to consider (and to understand) before simply swapping rotors and calipers from another car onto one axle, and expecting improved performance.

Regarding the red stuff vs. yellow stuff, the yellowstuff's minimum working temp is a whole 100 degrees higher than the reds. Nominal friction coefficients aside (which applies to their rated working range), it's pretty well-documented about the yellowstuff's lack of cold temp bite (again, that may not apply to you). I do see they upgraded the compound somewhat recently, so maybe my experience with them in winter almost 10 years ago is dated. But Yellowstuff on a 15 degree morning backing down a driveway has been an eye-opener for quite a few of us. Not a huge deal once you adjust for them...but yeah...certainly lacking cold bite particularly compared to OEM pads, which are famous for their initial grab. Even a cursory google search reveals plenty of reviews stating the same.
Sorry, so busy with everything else life presents, it took me a while to respond. Nice to hear additional input. I don't have the time to go back and do the research, measurements and math on it, but I'm super stoked with the functionality, and the wife simply says, "My brakes are awesome!"

I'm aware of most of what you've brought up, although may differ somewhat on opinion regarding the Yellows. Yeah, it stays pretty warm here. Strange to hear the Yellows are slick like ice cubes at 15*. That's a very rare cold day here, so no experience in those temps with them. Sounds fun!
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      10-19-2017, 10:59 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmwx1sq View Post
Good to know I just got a set and they are at the powder coats now. I was thinking of doing to rears also. Their is a guy on here that as the 370 m sport front and rear brakes on his x1.
I just bought a pair of blue M Sport 370mm calipers for the front of my CBM X3. I'll post up pics when that project's done. I think I'll be equally pleased with that setup on my car.
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      10-19-2017, 11:01 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hardparker View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmwx1sq View Post
Good to know I just got a set and they are at the powder coats now. I was thinking of doing to rears also. Their is a guy on here that as the 370 m sport front and rear brakes on his x1.
I just bought a pair of blue M Sport 370mm calipers for the front of my CBM X3. I'll post up pics when that project's done. I think I'll be equally pleased with that setup on my car.
That you get the rotors? I m not sure the size of the x3 ones. But the x1s are 340mm
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      10-19-2017, 11:10 AM   #9
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That you get the rotors? I m not sure the size of the x3 ones. But the x1s are 340mm
They're off of a 435i again, but this one with the upgraded, 370mm M Sport setup. I'm doing a new pair of Zimmerman dimpled and slotted rotors along with stainless lines, stainless speed bleeders, and once again, YellowStuff pads on my X3. Pretty excited!
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      10-19-2017, 11:15 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hardparker View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmwx1sq View Post
That you get the rotors? I m not sure the size of the x3 ones. But the x1s are 340mm
They're off of a 435i again, but this one with the upgraded, 370mm M Sport setup. I'm doing a new pair of Zimmerman dimpled and slotted rotors along with stainless lines, stainless speed bleeders, and once again, YellowStuff pads on my X3. Pretty excited!
Nice, what about the rears. I would think it would change the bias, but with the smaller one I would think it wouldn't have an issue. 370mm are about 1.25" bigger. What are the size of the x3?
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      10-19-2017, 12:14 PM   #11
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Quote:
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Nice, what about the rears. I would think it would change the bias, but with the smaller one I would think it wouldn't have an issue. 370mm are about 1.25" bigger. What are the size of the x3?
Fronts are going from 328/28mm to 370/30mm and the rears are staying at 330/20mm. Rears aren't easily replaceable on the F25 X3, since they have the electronic parking brake integrated into the caliper. They'll have to stay, but they'll get new rotors and YellowStuff pads and possibly a coat of blue paint to match the fronts.
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      10-19-2017, 12:19 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hardparker View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmwx1sq View Post
Nice, what about the rears. I would think it would change the bias, but with the smaller one I would think it wouldn't have an issue. 370mm are about 1.25" bigger. What are the size of the x3?
Fronts are going from 328/28mm to 370/30mm and the rears are staying at 330/20mm. Rears aren't easily replaceable on the F25 X3, since they have the electronic parking brake integrated into the caliper. They'll have to stay, but they'll get new rotors and YellowStuff pads and possibly a coat of blue paint to match the fronts.
Oh cool, I ll post mine up next week when I get them
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      10-22-2017, 07:37 PM   #13
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Got them back from the powder coaters and finished the rebuild tonight at work.
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      10-23-2017, 08:41 AM   #14
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Got them back from the powder coaters and finished the rebuild tonight at work.
Did you re-use all of the hardware, seals and boots that were previously on them, or did you get new ones? Seems like the actual piston seals are either hard to find or pricey.
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      10-23-2017, 09:14 AM   #15
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Quote:
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Quote:
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Got them back from the powder coaters and finished the rebuild tonight at work.
Did you re-use all of the hardware, seals and boots that were previously on them, or did you get new ones? Seems like the actual piston seals are either hard to find or pricey.
The car had 15k on it. I m reusing the piston seals but I got new dust seals. When I took them out I put brake assemble lube all over them. Never put brake cleaner on them. Before I put them back in I wiped them and they were still in good condition. I know turner Motorsport selling the seals by size if I measure them. I think they are 40mm pistons.
Did you rebuild yours?
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      10-25-2017, 11:16 PM   #16
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The car had 15k on it. I m reusing the piston seals but I got new dust seals. When I took them out I put brake assemble lube all over them. Never put brake cleaner on them. Before I put them back in I wiped them and they were still in good condition. I know turner Motorsport selling the seals by size if I measure them. I think they are 40mm pistons.
Did you rebuild yours?
Nope, didn't rebuild them. They had 13,000 miles and came from a salvaged 2016 435i. They barely looked used. I cleaned them to paint them and masked the piston boots and faces when I did.
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      11-01-2017, 11:13 PM   #17
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Rims and brake are mocked up. Tires next week with new rotors.
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      01-21-2022, 10:12 AM   #18
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I have a set of 370mm that I plan to install on my X1. bmx1sq was that the size you installed and how did everything work out for you? The set I have is from a F30

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      01-22-2022, 09:23 PM   #19
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not sure how i never seen this...now i'm on the hunt! is there specific year 335/435 brakes that will/won't work?
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      01-23-2022, 03:11 PM   #20
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Also, does it matter if msport or not? I haven't crossreferenced my break rotors to see if msport are larger than non-msport rotors on X1.
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      01-24-2022, 09:36 AM   #21
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I have a set of 370mm that I plan to install on my X1. bmx1sq was that the size you installed and how did everything work out for you? The set I have is from a F30
The car I want to modify is a non-msport
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      01-27-2022, 06:13 PM   #22
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I'm watching this thread tooo! Would love to have a list of parts to hunt for to do this caliper upgrade on my 2014 Sdrive.
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