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      07-22-2019, 08:20 AM   #1
bucketfoot
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Addressing high IAT

Has anyone with the N20 ever done something to address high intake air temps?

At two separate events now (both with a temp of 80+ and at an elevation of over 5000 ft) I've had power drop offs mid-session. The first time I suspected it was the IAT and this time I monitored it on track to confirm it.

There don't seem to be any intercooler upgrade option for E84 with N20, so I'm looking for thoughts on this.

One possible option is a cold-air intake, but I am skeptical about this really helping as I do not see how the options for our car will really result in lower IATs, as it just sits in the hot engine bay without piping in outside air.
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      07-24-2019, 11:13 PM   #2
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I had power drop off on that track everytime I cornered hard on some off camber areas on back of track.

I put 12mm spacers on front only of my 2014 s28i, and next time it didn't do that.

Do you mean power cut stays on?

My n20 runs pretty cool nearly anywhere; even if hot I probably don't see 150 IAT mostly 134 f.

It idles everywhere for a long time with 193 f coolant.
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      07-24-2019, 11:23 PM   #3
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Anyone ever try a water wetting spray on front rads to cool down for short time?

Fine mist to cool, but not wet track.
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      07-25-2019, 06:34 AM   #4
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Methanol injection is another option.
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      07-25-2019, 07:00 AM   #5
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I've heard of people getting limp mode when pushing car hard with those power increase mods.

Maybe something about overheating auto trans or front gearbox.

Anyone know how to get the transmission temp out of OBII plugin like scangauge?
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      07-25-2019, 11:12 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 0w40X1 View Post
I had power drop off on that track everytime I cornered hard on some off camber areas on back of track.
I'm actually seeing it the most on the straights. I will accelerate out of the corner just fine, then as I really start building speed the engine will kind of start lugging as if the boost is being cut back and finally start slowly re-gaining power & speed.

Also keep in mind that this is at an elevation of well over 5000 ft. So the combination of high temperatures and thin air are not exactly a good combination for optimum turbo performance!

I'll have to really comb through my TrackAddict logs to see what else I may be able to find is going on.
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      07-25-2019, 11:16 AM   #7
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The other thing I will do the next time I'm out in these conditions will be to do a session where I bypass the JB4 and run with the stock settings and see what happens.
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      07-25-2019, 09:08 PM   #8
0w40X1
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Ok, power loss and surge under high load and rpm.

That sounds like coils and/or plugs, and maybe fuel pump.

Even my Mazda RX8 did that on the track, and would momentarily throw code.

I put a Yukon coil upgrade and stronger fuel pump, since those things are weak on Mazdas.

HOw many miles on car and plugs?

And the JB4 is getting more work outta everything on engine.
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      07-25-2019, 09:30 PM   #9
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48k miles and plugs were replaced in April (so it has happened both before & after plug change).

I’ve had fuel starvation issues on cars before and this feels different. But then those were carbureted engines, so who knows.

All I’ve looked at in the data so far is IAT (which was over 170 at the time and was in the red in the JB4 app), but will definitely spend some time this weekend looking over all the parameters more closely.
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      07-25-2019, 11:23 PM   #10
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N20 is a pretty good engine away from the timing chain trouble, but maybe you're finding the limit of the JB4 tuning.

It might be fine on street, but running hard for 20 minutes or more is too much.

Maybe it's needing a richer tune, methanol injection, and or other fuel.

My s28i gives me all the smiles I can stand as stock M Sport even on that track.

I got 2 or 3 more mph acceleration in quarter mile just by putting 255/35r18 and 225/40r18 Michelin PS4S, and no traction loss now.

Also, by putting less grabby ceramic pads on rear, it stops that jerky rear tire wear out thing that slows car a little bit.
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      07-26-2019, 12:43 AM   #11
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Idea.....have you tried higher octane pure gas with no ethanol?

Also.....how much psi does your turbo give when stock, and how much does it give on the JB4?
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      07-26-2019, 09:43 AM   #12
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The stock flash will start to reducing timing advance and introduce more fuel to richen up and cool the combustion temps. The JB4 doesn't alter any of this. Without logs it is hard to speculate as to what is causing a surge. You should feel reduced power as the IATs climb that high. I would install a methanol kit if I were you. The stock intercooler will still be an issue but methanol will slow down the rate in which your IATs are climbing.
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      07-26-2019, 09:46 AM   #13
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I used Torco this time out to see if octane was a factor, but I have not tried ethanol free. The only place I know of that I can get it here is at the track, so I may to look around a little or try filling up there next time.

Between the altitude and temperature Iím pretty much thinking Iím starting to run into the limits of the car/engine (without further modification).

If thatís the case, Iím probably ok with it given that I regularly get comments from the guys in much higher performance cars (Camaro, Porsche, etc) on how surprised they are at how quick the X1 is
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      07-26-2019, 04:09 PM   #14
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That 1250 rpm low end torque surprises those guys, since they have more lag before the rpms get up. I got the same reaction at COTA Austin, Tx.

You don't even have to fill up, just put 5 gallons in when you're down to 1/4 tank.
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      07-26-2019, 09:22 PM   #15
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Just out of curiosity for you guys who track their cars, do you have any concerns about the timing chain failures? I know the percentage of failure rates are low, but just curious about the added stress to the engine of tracking the car.
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      07-26-2019, 10:28 PM   #16
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No....for one thing I don't even use the paddle shifters except when shifting around on a mountain at slower speeds.

The transmission knows the loads and when to shift which is better than any mortal can do.

I still only have 26k miles on a 6 year X1, and I'm going to a slightly thicker oil, Mobil 1 0w40, instead of the BMW 5w30.

Also, I just drive maybe 3 - 20 minute runs until I get tire pressures sorted.

I also, don't drive if temp is gonna be over 90. I can't take heat nor can tires.

Some people drive hell outta car while I use track to drive like I can't do on street.

One guy said I wasn't driving hard enough cause I wasn't going through brake pads.

My retort is: "I wanna drive car at it's limit, not be free bed test of parts."

Since it's not a race, and we can't use late braking to pass, car shouldn't be beat up.
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      07-27-2019, 09:25 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m1256 View Post
Just out of curiosity for you guys who track their cars, do you have any concerns about the timing chain failures? I know the percentage of failure rates are low, but just curious about the added stress to the engine of tracking the car.
Nope, doesn't even cross my mind.

After initially trying manual shifting I find the car does a better job in sport mode than I can do manually (this is true in virtually any performance oriented car these days). Doing this helps assures that I don't over rev the engine or do anything too stupid.

Having been involved in the injection molding process of plastics for way more years than I want to admit to, my personal belief is that the guide issue is more likely driven by variances in batches of the material and tool adjustment periods than it is with driving styles or maintenance practices (aside from being completely abusive and doing no maintenance).
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      07-27-2019, 07:21 PM   #18
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I think you nailed it.

It's about whether the plastic is defective or not.....not about maintenance.

So, maybe i don't know my own car.....What is sport mode?

I thought that might be with paddles.
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      07-27-2019, 07:38 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 0w40X1 View Post
So, maybe i don't know my own car.....What is sport mode?
That's were you put the car in drive then pull the lever to the left. The dash indicator should say "DS" instead of "D".

Just like if you manually shift without paddles, except you leave the shifter stationary rather than bumping it up or down.
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      07-27-2019, 09:06 PM   #20
0w40X1
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Ok....good to know.

My s28i runs to redline to shift when I floor it, so I'm confused.

Is it a harder shift?
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