XBimmers X1   XBimmers X1
  XBimmers X1

Go Back   XBimmers | BMW X1 Forum > BMW X1 Forums > General BMW X1 (E84) Forum

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      08-10-2015, 08:34 PM   #1
PrematureApex
Colonel
506
Rep
2,256
Posts

Drives: N55 X1, N54 135, s54 m3
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Philadelphia

iTrader: (0)

The Shock/Strut Thread

After throwing on the H&R springs, I've come to the conclusion that stronger shocks/struts are certainly needed.

The only real option are Bilstein HDs. I run them on my 135i (w/stock springs) and love them.

They don't make Bilstein Sports for the X1 (not even special order, like the front HDs are anyway).

Do we think the HDs are going to bottom-out like the stock shocks do on the H&Rs over large bumps at high speed?

Since the H&R springs are "designed" to work with the stock shocks (ha), I'm thinking the HDs may be fine. I'm hoping the added stiffness of the HDs will be able to keep them from crashing on the internal bump stops....but I'm not sure.

I'll be pissed if they are prone to the same bad behavior as the stock shocks are, after dropping $650 on them and waiting 3 months to get the fronts produced/shipped.

Any thoughts? I'll post comments after I get them (first the rears, then both).
__________________
'02 S54 M3 (500/500 GC/Koni)
'08 N54 135 (JB4, DCI, BMW PS/Bilstein B6s, H&R M3 FSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'14 N55 X1 (JB4, BMS DP, BMS Intake, Alpina TCU reflash, H&R Sports, Bilstein B6s, E93 M3 RSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'08 N54 535xi touring (MHD stage 1)
Appreciate 0
      08-10-2015, 09:19 PM   #2
PrematureApex
Colonel
506
Rep
2,256
Posts

Drives: N55 X1, N54 135, s54 m3
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Philadelphia

iTrader: (0)

Worse comes to worse, it seems people have had success with trimming the internal bump stops on HDs struts...so maybe there's hope for them up front even if they do still bottom out a bit too frequently.
__________________
'02 S54 M3 (500/500 GC/Koni)
'08 N54 135 (JB4, DCI, BMW PS/Bilstein B6s, H&R M3 FSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'14 N55 X1 (JB4, BMS DP, BMS Intake, Alpina TCU reflash, H&R Sports, Bilstein B6s, E93 M3 RSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'08 N54 535xi touring (MHD stage 1)
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 12:06 AM   #3
Twix
Lieutenant Colonel
Twix's Avatar
Canada
258
Rep
1,722
Posts

Drives: F87 LBB 6MT
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Calgary, AB, Canada

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2016 BMW M2  [0.00]
The stiffer valving should help, but I wouldn't be surprised if they still bottom out. I have the same problem with my rears. I bottom out just going over bridge joints if I'm at a high speed. It really unsettles the rear end.

Let us know how it works when you get them. Maybe Koni can make custom length shocks and struts.
__________________
2016 M2 - 6MT
2014 X1 - Sold
2002 Land Rover Discovery II - 3" TF lift - 42" LED bar - 4" LED spots
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 03:21 AM   #4
andybmr
Enlisted Member
0
Rep
41
Posts

Drives: 2015 x1 xdrive 28i
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Las Vegas

iTrader: (0)

Hello Guys! I just ordered my H&R springs from Turner today for my 2105 x1 xdrive 28i will it still be ok to install them? Input on how the ride is with H&R springs Thanks!
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 04:16 AM   #5
GRANTLDN
Second Lieutenant
GRANTLDN's Avatar
United Kingdom
20
Rep
221
Posts

Drives: BMW X1 20D
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: London, UK

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by andybmr View Post
Hello Guys! I just ordered my H&R springs from Turner today for my 2105 x1 xdrive 28i will it still be ok to install them? Input on how the ride is with H&R springs Thanks!
From what I have read on here they seem quite soft once they settle in but if you hit a horrible hump you will know about it. They also recommend you change your rear subframe bushes also.

Ordering mine soon.
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 04:51 AM   #6
andybmr
Enlisted Member
0
Rep
41
Posts

Drives: 2015 x1 xdrive 28i
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Las Vegas

iTrader: (0)

Thanks GRANTLDN! Who makes subframe bushings for x1 power flex? To bad no sport shocks are being sold for it. Was looking at bilstein set up but according to turner motorsport not available at this time.
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 08:13 AM   #7
PrematureApex
Colonel
506
Rep
2,256
Posts

Drives: N55 X1, N54 135, s54 m3
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Philadelphia

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Twix View Post
The stiffer valving should help, but I wouldn't be surprised if they still bottom out. I have the same problem with my rears. I bottom out just going over bridge joints if I'm at a high speed. It really unsettles the rear end.

Let us know how it works when you get them. Maybe Koni can make custom length shocks and struts.
Exactly. I can deal with the slight increase in oscillations/settling time, and the ride is AOK in 95% of situations...

But the highway speed joints/buckles, buck the rear end HARD. The bump stops haven't been trimmed back there...but I'm not sure that would help, as it's hitting them so hard.

Good news is I should get the HD rears in a couple weeks vs. months. I'll throw them on and report back.

Overall, I'm sure the springs are 100% great for most people, especially if you live in areas with nicer roads. Heck, even the ride on rough rods is fine. It's really just the situations you describe.

In all honesty, it may have been a better idea for me to have ordered 335 HD rears, or even 335 Sports vs. what are likely to be longer X1 HD rears. Wasn't going to be the test-dummy for that though.
__________________
'02 S54 M3 (500/500 GC/Koni)
'08 N54 135 (JB4, DCI, BMW PS/Bilstein B6s, H&R M3 FSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'14 N55 X1 (JB4, BMS DP, BMS Intake, Alpina TCU reflash, H&R Sports, Bilstein B6s, E93 M3 RSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'08 N54 535xi touring (MHD stage 1)
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 08:16 AM   #8
PrematureApex
Colonel
506
Rep
2,256
Posts

Drives: N55 X1, N54 135, s54 m3
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Philadelphia

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by andybmr View Post
Thanks GRANTLDN! Who makes subframe bushings for x1 power flex? To bad no sport shocks are being sold for it. Was looking at bilstein set up but according to turner motorsport not available at this time.
The Prokit or just HD shocks?

The HD shocks are "available", but the fronts are special order from Germany (and will always be as far as I can tell).

It's a shame, they should just sell us OTS 335 xdrive shocks with an adapter sleeve.

As for bushings, Whilteline are the cheapest, and like any two-piece poly, are much easier to install vs. OE M3.

http://www.topgearsolutions.com/whit...g-bmw-e90.html
__________________
'02 S54 M3 (500/500 GC/Koni)
'08 N54 135 (JB4, DCI, BMW PS/Bilstein B6s, H&R M3 FSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'14 N55 X1 (JB4, BMS DP, BMS Intake, Alpina TCU reflash, H&R Sports, Bilstein B6s, E93 M3 RSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'08 N54 535xi touring (MHD stage 1)
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 08:04 PM   #9
Twix
Lieutenant Colonel
Twix's Avatar
Canada
258
Rep
1,722
Posts

Drives: F87 LBB 6MT
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Calgary, AB, Canada

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2016 BMW M2  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by PrematureApex View Post
It's a shame, they should just sell us OTS 335 xdrive shocks with an adapter sleeve.
http://www.topgearsolutions.com/whit...g-bmw-e90.html
The valving might be too soft for the X1's 3800-3900lbs weight vs. the ~3500-3600 for the 335xi.

There's a few offroad companies that custom make shocks, but I'm not sure if they would make the front struts. Or if they would even have the ability given the brand of vehicle we're talking about.
__________________
2016 M2 - 6MT
2014 X1 - Sold
2002 Land Rover Discovery II - 3" TF lift - 42" LED bar - 4" LED spots
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 08:22 PM   #10
paradoxical3
Lieutenant Colonel
684
Rep
1,545
Posts

Drives: BMW
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: USA

iTrader: (6)

335xi is 3800lbs.

To get a truly proper ride for the X1 you will have to move to a coilover setup. KW makes a decent entry level one, I have a custom setup from JRZ.
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 09:29 PM   #11
PrematureApex
Colonel
506
Rep
2,256
Posts

Drives: N55 X1, N54 135, s54 m3
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Philadelphia

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxical3 View Post
335xi is 3800lbs.

To get a truly proper ride for the X1 you will have to move to a coilover setup. KW makes a decent entry level one, I have a custom setup from JRZ.
I'm not discounting what good coilovers (read: the good dampers that come with good coilovers, and their proper body length) bring to the table. I'm a KW V3 guy.

But what is your basis for this statement?

A couple of things...

On the H&Rs, the X1 still rides higher than a stock 335 does. At 3800#, the 335 x is right with the X1. No reason a shock built for that car couldn't work. Maybe more generally, do we even know if the shock body of a 335 koni/bilstein is shorter than that of the X1? Perhaps it's not. And if it is, well, that's another reason to think it may be a viable, if not perfect option.

The reason the car is compressing the rear stops on BIG high speed jolts is, quite simply, that we took away 1.5+" of rear travel, and left the bump stops the same length.

As with all modern BMWs, they're into the bump stops VERY early (my M3 is into them within maybe .5" of travel).

For all we know, giving the car back the bit of travel lost via lowering is all that is required (via trimming the stops). There's nothing inherent to the X1 that means this isn't the case. Could it be that the shock body is simply too long, maybe. But at this point, it's way too early to tell. There's no sound reason why if you gave the car back something close to its OE travel length (before hitting the end of the OE stops), it couldn't ride very well. What we have to do is see if that is possible with a stock-replacement shock body.

Until then, I'm not sure you can make the statement you're making. Again, this isn't a 335 ride height wise. It doesn't necessarily have the severely-limited travel issues it has, somewhat necessitating coilovers.

You jumped right to coilovers before there were any shock options right?
__________________
'02 S54 M3 (500/500 GC/Koni)
'08 N54 135 (JB4, DCI, BMW PS/Bilstein B6s, H&R M3 FSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'14 N55 X1 (JB4, BMS DP, BMS Intake, Alpina TCU reflash, H&R Sports, Bilstein B6s, E93 M3 RSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'08 N54 535xi touring (MHD stage 1)
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 09:34 PM   #12
paradoxical3
Lieutenant Colonel
684
Rep
1,545
Posts

Drives: BMW
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: USA

iTrader: (6)

Quote:
Originally Posted by PrematureApex View Post
I'm not discounting what good coilovers (read: the good dampeners that come with coilovers, and their proper body length) bring to the table.

But what is your basis for this statement?
Aside that this entire thread exists about people not being satisfied while I enjoy a ride that is as good or better than stock while using 11k/17k springs....

Quote:
On the H&Rs, the X1 still rides higher than a stock 335 does. At 3800#, the 335 x is right with the X1. No reason a shock built for that car couldn't work.
I have tried it and they will top out on rebound. Have to either have a custom setup done or use a spacer.

Quote:
Maybe more generally, do we even know if the shock body of a 335 koni/bilstein is shorter than that of the X1? Perhaps it's not.
Not sure particularly with Koni, but on KW and JRZ they are shorter. And it varies from damper to damper...JRZ RS1 for 335i xdrive worked while the twintube RS2 design needed to be modified. Basically, it is extremely close and probably too close for comfort in most applications.

Quote:
The reason the car is smacking into the rear stops on BIG high speed jolts is probably, quite simply, that you took away 1.5" of rear travel, and left the bump stops the same length.
Or spring rates are set entirely wrong due to a compromised setup.

Quote:
You jumped right to coilovers...so again...what are you using as the basis for the statement?
Why would you go through all of this expense and trouble when you can get KW V1 for a bit over a grand?

Stuff like the rear end bouncing and the car being unsettled over highway expansion joints just shouldn't happen, it is ridiculous. I would never accept that. I can barely feel highway expansion joints and can go WOT over them while kicking the back end out with zero shimmy or unsettling behavior. Suspensions are complicated, and labor to tweak them is expensive. I have learned this the hard way. Find a shop that actually has a racing program and understands how suspensions work to set up your car.

Last edited by paradoxical3; 08-11-2015 at 09:39 PM.
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 09:39 PM   #13
PrematureApex
Colonel
506
Rep
2,256
Posts

Drives: N55 X1, N54 135, s54 m3
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Philadelphia

iTrader: (0)

My post was edited significantly since you posted.

From what I can tell, the KWs are much too low for me, even on their highest setting. This is generally because all the KWs are are 335 parts with a sleeve in the front.

So the 335 shocks didn't have enough stroke length? OK great, so you can't discount decent X1-length shocks with a modest drop, until you cover all of your basis.

Again, you're an asset to the forum, and a good guy, but you can't make the statement you made when...well...literally no one has tried it before.
__________________
'02 S54 M3 (500/500 GC/Koni)
'08 N54 135 (JB4, DCI, BMW PS/Bilstein B6s, H&R M3 FSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'14 N55 X1 (JB4, BMS DP, BMS Intake, Alpina TCU reflash, H&R Sports, Bilstein B6s, E93 M3 RSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'08 N54 535xi touring (MHD stage 1)
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 09:46 PM   #14
paradoxical3
Lieutenant Colonel
684
Rep
1,545
Posts

Drives: BMW
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: USA

iTrader: (6)

What are your goals with the suspension modifications you are making in terms of ride quality, performance, and appearance?
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 09:47 PM   #15
PrematureApex
Colonel
506
Rep
2,256
Posts

Drives: N55 X1, N54 135, s54 m3
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Philadelphia

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxical3 View Post

Stuff like the rear end bouncing and the car being unsettled over highway expansion joints just shouldn't happen, it is ridiculous. I would never accept that.


Of course not, hence the reason for this thread. It's also extremely common when adding lowering springs to cars.

Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxical3 View Post
Suspensions are complicated, and labor to tweak them is expensive. I have learned this the hard way. Find a shop that actually has a racing program and understands how suspensions work to set up your car.
Thanks for the tip. I know you're a guy that uses a shop for his wrenching...which is never a bad way to go.

I'm an ex-ME, who's hand fabricated a few open wheel formula cars in my day, done ground up suspension work in Mitchell, worked for Sachs, etc.

I'm just fine trying things in the driveway on the weekends for my wife's daily driver.

You simply can't make the statements you're making because neither you, nor any "race shop", has tried yet regarding the X1. Hell, it's a 14 week wait for decent aftermarket front struts. As far as I can tell, no one on the boards has even bolted a set on yet.
__________________
'02 S54 M3 (500/500 GC/Koni)
'08 N54 135 (JB4, DCI, BMW PS/Bilstein B6s, H&R M3 FSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'14 N55 X1 (JB4, BMS DP, BMS Intake, Alpina TCU reflash, H&R Sports, Bilstein B6s, E93 M3 RSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'08 N54 535xi touring (MHD stage 1)
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 09:53 PM   #16
paradoxical3
Lieutenant Colonel
684
Rep
1,545
Posts

Drives: BMW
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: USA

iTrader: (6)

Quote:
Originally Posted by PrematureApex View Post


Of course not, hence the reason for this thread. It's also extremely common when adding lowering springs to cars.



Thanks for the tip. I know you're a guy that uses a shop for his wrenching...which is never a bad way to go.

I'm an ex-ME, who's hand fabricated a few open wheel formula cars in my day, done ground up suspension work in Mitchell, worked for Sachs, etc.

I'm just fine trying things in the driveway on the weekends for my wife's daily driver.

You simply can't make the statements you're making because neither you, nor any "race shop", has tried yet regarding the X1. Hell, it's a 14 week wait for decent aftermarket front struts. As far as I can tell, no one on the boards has even bolted a set on yet.
If you did suspension work you would understand that the dampers are not supposed to support the weight of the car. This is a function of the springs. Adding a damper that is valved for a stiffer spring to a soft spring will create an uncomfortable ride that will still bottom out.

How do I know?

Because I have tried JRZ RS1 with soft 7k/14k springs and bottomed out on full stiff.

I may use a shop for my wrenching (I live in a condo with a HOA that says I can't work on my car), but I have spent $10,000 trying numerous suspension setups, spring rates, and dampers on my car. My comments are from experience.

Quote:
Do we think the HDs are going to bottom-out like the stock shocks do on the H&Rs over large bumps at high speed?
Yes, I have tried a similar setup. Springs and dampers need to be matched to each other for optimal ride quality and performance, and the weight of the car should not be supported by the damper. Adding a stiff damper to overly soft springs will not fix bottoming out.

Quote:
Since the H&R springs are "designed" to work with the stock shocks (ha), I'm thinking the HDs may be fine. I'm hoping the added stiffness of the HDs will be able to keep them from crashing on the internal bump stops....but I'm not sure.
This will not work and will result in an uncomfortably stiff ride over small impacts, while still bottoming out and bouncing over large ones.
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 09:55 PM   #17
PrematureApex
Colonel
506
Rep
2,256
Posts

Drives: N55 X1, N54 135, s54 m3
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Philadelphia

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxical3 View Post
What are your goals with the suspension modifications you are making in terms of ride quality, performance, and appearance?
Listen, I know you're trying to be helpful, but you're not talking to a typical X1 owner.

From what I can gather, you paid a shop to build your car. That's just fine, but I don't need you to cover suspension 101 with me. I've been at it with BMWs for going on 2 decades.

Wife likes the ride height of the H&Rs (about 1.5 lower than stock). They're fine ride wise...a bit underdamped (but as you can tell by reviews, not so much that most members even notice). Something like an HD will sort that out I have no doubt.

That just leaves the question of rear travel. Again, maybe the stock bodies are too long. But we just took away 1.5"+ of rear travel when lowering by not replacing/trimming the stops.

So, without having yet tried that, there's literally no way to definitively state that the stock-sized shock body doesn't have the compression travel to perform perfectly fine for all road conditions.

Maybe it won't, but it very well may. You simply cannot make the statement until you've tried.

I'm hopeful, as it's pretty darn close to enough travel as it sits.
__________________
'02 S54 M3 (500/500 GC/Koni)
'08 N54 135 (JB4, DCI, BMW PS/Bilstein B6s, H&R M3 FSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'14 N55 X1 (JB4, BMS DP, BMS Intake, Alpina TCU reflash, H&R Sports, Bilstein B6s, E93 M3 RSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'08 N54 535xi touring (MHD stage 1)
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 10:02 PM   #18
paradoxical3
Lieutenant Colonel
684
Rep
1,545
Posts

Drives: BMW
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: USA

iTrader: (6)

Quote:
Originally Posted by PrematureApex View Post
Listen, I know you're trying to be helpful, but you're not talking to a typical X1 owner.

From what I can gather, you paid a shop to build your car. That's just fine, but I don't need you to cover suspension 101 with me. I've been at it with BMWs for going on 2 decades.
Tons of people build suspensions. Few build them right. Your misunderstanding of basic terms and principles leads me to believe you are in the latter category. But what do I know, I only have hundreds of hours of seat time in the X1 on the road course tuning suspensions, and 59,000 miles on the street. How many do you have in the vehicle on track?


Quote:
Wife likes the ride height of the H&Rs (about 1.5 lower than stock). They're fine ride wise...a bit underdamped (but as you can tell by reviews, not so much that most members even notice).
Springs have nothing to do with dampening. A spring cannot be "underdamped."

Quote:
Something like an HD will sort that out I have no doubt.
Good luck, you'll still bottom out.

Quote:
That just leaves the question of rear travel. Again, maybe the stock bodies are too long. But we just took away 1.5"+ of rear travel when lowering by not replacing/trimming the stops.
It makes more sense to cut the bump stops than it does to switch to stiffer dampers. I would try this first. Stiffer dampers will make your ride WORSE without a stiffer spring.
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 10:04 PM   #19
PrematureApex
Colonel
506
Rep
2,256
Posts

Drives: N55 X1, N54 135, s54 m3
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Philadelphia

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxical3 View Post
If you did suspension work you would understand that the dampers are not supposed to support the weight of the car. This is a function of the springs. Adding a damper that is valved for a stiffer spring to a soft spring will create an uncomfortable ride that will still bottom out..
What are you talking about? If you know how dampers work, you'd know they can't support the weight of the car. Spring support the car.

A stiffer damper, however, can slightly reduce suspension travel during quick high speed impacts (and transient maneuvers...but not generally in steady state cornering). That's suspension 101.

I clearly mentioned giving back more OE-like travel via the bumpstops. But it's so close, a bit firmer compression dampening may very well be enough on it's own.

No one is adding dampeners that are valved for stiffer springs. HDs are loved by many for use with stock springs, as well as OE-type sport springs having close to stock rates.


Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxical3 View Post
I may use a shop for my wrenching (I live in a condo with a HOA that says I can't work on my car), but I have spent $10,000 trying numerous suspension setups, spring rates, and dampers on my car. My comments are from experience.
Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxical3 View Post
My comments are from experience.
Really?

Tell us, when did you run H&R springs on aftermarket shocks with trimmed bump stops?

You're really being a jerk here, as you're claiming to speak from experience with something you clearly have not experienced.
__________________
'02 S54 M3 (500/500 GC/Koni)
'08 N54 135 (JB4, DCI, BMW PS/Bilstein B6s, H&R M3 FSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'14 N55 X1 (JB4, BMS DP, BMS Intake, Alpina TCU reflash, H&R Sports, Bilstein B6s, E93 M3 RSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'08 N54 535xi touring (MHD stage 1)

Last edited by PrematureApex; 08-11-2015 at 10:19 PM.
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 10:10 PM   #20
PrematureApex
Colonel
506
Rep
2,256
Posts

Drives: N55 X1, N54 135, s54 m3
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Philadelphia

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxical3 View Post
But what do I know, I only have hundreds of hours of seat time in the X1 on the road course tuning suspensions, and 59,000 miles on the street. How many do you have in the vehicle on track?
Once again, you have no experience with the setup we're talking about.

PCA instructor for 10 years.

I love how you think 10 track events in instructed groups makes you some kind of suspension expert.

You're a novice track guy, get over yourself.

Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxical3 View Post
Springs have nothing to do with dampening. A spring cannot be "underdamped.".
?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Damping

The spring is oscillating too much. It's motion is not dampened enough. Are you playing semantics with that statement?

Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxical3 View Post
It makes more sense to cut the bump stops than it does to switch to stiffer dampers. I would try this first. Stiffer dampers will make your ride WORSE without a stiffer spring.
Are you reading some other thread?

I said the car was underdamped. To take care of the oscillations, it needs more dampening.

That's a separate issue than the bottoming out, which I made quite clear. Seriously, have you not been reading my posts?

What I said was, the added compression dampening may help the rare bottoming out issue. That is 100% a realistic possibility that can only be determined by actually trying it. Which you haven't. You have absolutely ZERO idea how much extra travel is needed (or needs to be negated) to cure the problem. Zero.

Your experience with your JRZs isn't even remotely close to proof-positive of anything. The fact that you could make such a statement with a straight face is laughable.
__________________
'02 S54 M3 (500/500 GC/Koni)
'08 N54 135 (JB4, DCI, BMW PS/Bilstein B6s, H&R M3 FSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'14 N55 X1 (JB4, BMS DP, BMS Intake, Alpina TCU reflash, H&R Sports, Bilstein B6s, E93 M3 RSB, Strongflex FCABs)
'08 N54 535xi touring (MHD stage 1)

Last edited by PrematureApex; 08-11-2015 at 10:22 PM.
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 10:11 PM   #21
paradoxical3
Lieutenant Colonel
684
Rep
1,545
Posts

Drives: BMW
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: USA

iTrader: (6)

Quote:
Originally Posted by PrematureApex View Post
What are you talking about? If you know how dampers work, you'd know they can't support the weight of the car. Spring support the car.
That's exactly what I said...

Quote:
A stiffer damper, however, will slightly reduce suspension travel on high speed impacts (not in steady state cornering). That's suspension 101.
At the expense of ride quality.

Quote:
No one is adding dampeners that are valved for stiffer springs. HDs are loved by many for use with stock springs, as well as OE-type sport springs having close to stock rates.
You literally said the HDs are stiffer than your current dampers (not "dampeners"). The product page says they are stiffer than your current dampers.

Quote:
Again, you're posting like you're talking to to newb here. I've run about 10 times more suspension setups on BMWs than you have, I promise.
Cool, what are your lap times at Mid Ohio, Putnam Park, Watkins Glen, Summit Raceway, Pueblo Motorsports park, and NCM? Or by "suspensions" did you mean you're part of the "hard parker" crowd?


Quote:
Tell us, when did you run H&R springs on aftermarket shocks with trimmed bump stops?
I would never do that, I value a properly set up suspension.

Quote:
You're really being a jerk here, as you're claiming to speak from experience with something you clearly have not experienced.
You're the one that started throwing out veiled jabs about me paying a shop to build my car, and stating that you're such the expert. You literally started a thread wondering why throwing some springs on a car upsets ride quality.

If you are such the suspension expert, why are you even making this thread instead of just doing it yourself?

Enjoy your springs, I'll be enjoying a proper suspension. It's your car/money.
Appreciate 0
      08-11-2015, 10:13 PM   #22
paradoxical3
Lieutenant Colonel
684
Rep
1,545
Posts

Drives: BMW
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: USA

iTrader: (6)

Quote:
Originally Posted by PrematureApex View Post
Once again, you have no experience with the setup we're talking about.

PCA instructor for 10 years.

I love how you think 10 track events in instructed groups makes you some kind of suspension expert.

You're a novice track guy, get over yourself.
Ah, PCA - that explains it. Pick an event. $1000 in cash if you're faster than me in any of your cars. I'll pay for your track day on top of it if you are faster in your X1 with H&Rs.

I prefer 10/10ths motorsports, but as a PCA driver you may not be comfortable with the open passing with no point by rules that we run.

Last edited by paradoxical3; 08-11-2015 at 10:24 PM.
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:23 AM.




xbimmers
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST