X1 crashed. Dealer wants to loan me a Sonata

[MrSnrub]

My beloved wife was behind the wheel of our X1 yesterday during a collision. Everyone is okay, except for the car. In certainly thankful she is okay and that our 5 month old son wasn't in the car. The car is en route by tow to the dealer's body shop. Insurance is on board. It's a leased BMW, so the strong preference was to use the dealer's shop for repairs/bodywork.

The dealer offered a loaner, but it is a Hyundai Sonata. A new one, yes, but I'm annoyed. I'm paying for a BMW. The x1 protected my now driving-shy wife very well. I want her in another BMW, cost aside. What has everyone's experience been with loaners? The dealer sells many more Ford and Hyundai than BMW, I'd wager. The sales associate is a good guy and I got an excellent deal. On one hand, I want to argue for a proper loaner. On the other, I'm chagrined about quibbling with a nice guy (and maybe escalating to someone more senior).

Any advice or anecdotes appreciated.

[Red Bread]

It's probably safer than the X1 in reality. Generally the service department has BMW's for loaners, but they aren't gone for long and they really only do that to tempt you with a newer, fresher car. The body shop likely doesn't use BMW's for loaners but just hands out the Hyundais. I'd say it's fair, but it really can't hurt anything to ask if they have a BMW they'd loan you. At the very least, call your sales guy and tell him what happened, see if the dealer instead of the body shop will set you up.

[danielj]

I was unaware that BMW was required to offer loaners for accident repair. For service maintenance, yes.

Typically loaners during bodywork are actually rentals with costs covered by your or the other parties insurance company.

IIHS rates the Sonata as "good" all around which is well, good.

[MrSnrub]

All fair points. I spoke to the dealer again. He can't loan any of their BMWs long-term, just for overnight service appointments. It's a reasonable situation, I suppose. I'm certainly not looking a gift horse in the mouth, as my insurance coverage for renting a replacement is only $30/day.

[bmwx3805]

Originally Posted by MrSnrub

My beloved wife was behind the wheel of our X1 yesterday during a collision. Everyone is okay, except for the car. In certainly thankful she is okay and that our 5 month old son wasn't in the car. The car is en route by tow to the dealer's body shop. Insurance is on board. It's a leased BMW, so the strong preference was to use the dealer's shop for repairs/bodywork.

The dealer offered a loaner, but it is a Hyundai Sonata. A new one, yes, but I'm annoyed. I'm paying for a BMW. The x1 protected my now driving-shy wife very well. I want her in another BMW, cost aside. What has everyone's experience been with loaners? The dealer sells many more Ford and Hyundai than BMW, I'd wager. The sales associate is a good guy and I got an excellent deal. On one hand, I want to argue for a proper loaner. On the other, I'm chagrined about quibbling with a nice guy (and maybe escalating to someone more senior).

Any advice or anecdotes appreciated.

when my x1 got crashed they gave me a ford 2013 focus. i hated it. the trans made a grinding sound when you took off from a stop. radio and its functions only worked when it felt like and it was very noisy inside.

[EpistemicConfusion]

I understand where you are coming from, but just having "graduated" from a VW, I can tell you that BMW offering you a loaner that is anything but what the rental lot down the street carries is better than what my options were.

And really, the Sonata is not a bad car, nor an unsafe car.

[Raja Ventureshield]

Sonata sucks and looks horrible. I rather drive a civic instead.

[HBWT]

Originally Posted by danielj

I was unaware that BMW was required to offer loaners for accident repair. For service maintenance, yes.

BMW isn't "required" to supply loaners for anything. That is completely up to the servicing dealer. Most BMW dealers supply loaners for service and many of them provide BMWs but rarely ever would a body work customer get a BMW loaner.

[MrSnrub]

I thought I'd give this a bump, mainly out of frustration. I still don't have my X1 back.
Reasons?
1. when they realized there was additional damage inside the door, they had to order more parts. Those parts took a long time.
2. the original parts took so long, they decided to order a fully factory-welded door frame/pillar assembly. This took a long time to come.
3. while attaching the fully factory-welded door assembly, they decided they should get a new roof. the wrong roof arrived and had to be re-ordered.
4. finally, it was supposed to be done on Wednesday. They took it to the dealership (the dealership and body shop are the same owners, but across town from one another) to clear codes and found a persistent code they could not clear. The source? They accidentally melted part of the main wiring harness while welding. They've ordered a new one, which will take 5-19 days to produce and then must be shipped from Germany.

It has been so long, in fact, that the insurance check expires tomorrow! I'm talking with the shop manager and the sales manager today to discuss remuneration. I've been patient and they've been forthright for the most part. I've had a Sonata, an Altima, and we have a Santa Fe now, as loaners -- but this is the last straw.

[squishy]

Wow, that sounds like a nightmare. Sorry to hear about this, and hope things get resolved soon.

[paradoxical3]

Originally Posted by MrSnrub

I thought I'd give this a bump, mainly out of frustration. I still don't have my X1 back.
Reasons?
1. when they realized there was additional damage inside the door, they had to order more parts. Those parts took a long time.
2. the original parts took so long, they decided to order a fully factory-welded door frame/pillar assembly. This took a long time to come.
3. while attaching the fully factory-welded door assembly, they decided they should get a new roof. the wrong roof arrived and had to be re-ordered.
4. finally, it was supposed to be done on Wednesday. They took it to the dealership (the dealership and body shop are the same owners, but across town from one another) to clear codes and found a persistent code they could not clear. The source? They accidentally melted part of the main wiring harness while welding. They've ordered a new one, which will take 5-19 days to produce and then must be shipped from Germany.

It has been so long, in fact, that the insurance check expires tomorrow! I'm talking with the shop manager and the sales manager today to discuss remuneration. I've been patient and they've been forthright for the most part. I've had a Sonata, an Altima, and we have a Santa Fe now, as loaners -- but this is the last straw.

Ask for a buyback. The process is called BMW trade assist. I went through it and it worked out great.

[Black Flagged]

Originally Posted by paradoxical3

Ask for a buyback. The process is called BMW trade assist. I went through it and it worked out great.

tell us more on how that whole process worked out from start to finish

[paradoxical3]

Originally Posted by Gangsta D

tell us more on how that whole process worked out from start to finish

It's a goodwill process by BMW that is designed to get people out of cars that have been in the shop excessively long. Now there are a couple of caveats to that. First, they are much more likely to do something if you're past the official lemon law standards in your state. They lose more money if you lemon law it legally so they basically take care of you to avoid that process. In ohio the lemon law says

"In the first year or first 18,000 miles, whichever occurs first:
• Have three or more attempts been made to repair one problem and then the problem either continues to exist or occurs again?
• Has the vehicle been in the shop for a cumulative total of 30 days or more during its first year or 18,000 miles, whichever occurs first?
• Have eight or more attempts been made to fix different problems?
• Has one unsuccessful attempt been made to fix a problem that could cause death or serious injury?"

In the OP's case they will push back because the original reason for being in the shop was not BMW's fault. However, they should be liable for the parts delays as well as the faulty welding. If those days add up to over 30 days in the shop than the OP probably has grounds for a lemon law buyback. Further, BMW has precedent for doing trade assists as a result of parts availability - when the 335 HPFPs were failing and there was a several month delay, several forum members got a trade assist. You shouldn't be paying for a BMW for months and driving a Hyundai as a result of BMW's failure to procure parts to repair your car in a timely manner. At this point that's what I'd pursue especially because of the lost value to the car.

If the dealership and BMW NA don't want to play ball I'd get a lemon law attorney. They work for free and get paid by the manufacturer after they win. $100 says once they get the letter informing them that you've aligned yourself with a lemon law lawyer they play ball with the trade assist.

[tuco44]

Originally Posted by paradoxical3

Ask for a buyback. The process is called BMW trade assist. I went through it and it worked out great.

I can't see how an accident could result in a buyback. Makes no sense to me, it is not BMW's fault that the car has taken so long to be repaired.

[paradoxical3]

Originally Posted by tuco44

I can't see how an accident could result in a buyback. Makes no sense to me, it is not BMW's fault that the car has taken so long to be repaired.

The car is en route by tow to the dealer's body shop.

BMW is the one repairing it.

the original parts took so long, they decided to order a fully factory-welded door frame/pillar assembly. This took a long time to come.

BMW's fault for un-timely delivery and incorrect parts delivery.

3. while attaching the fully factory-welded door assembly, they decided they should get a new roof. the wrong roof arrived and had to be re-ordered.

BMW's fault for not correctly assessing damage and again untimely delivery

4. finally, it was supposed to be done on Wednesday. They took it to the dealership (the dealership and body shop are the same owners, but across town from one another) to clear codes and found a persistent code they could not clear. The source? They accidentally melted part of the main wiring harness while welding. They've ordered a new one, which will take 5-19 days to produce and then must be shipped from Germany.

BMW's fault for screwing up the repair. This right here will qualify in Ohio as a lemon law if it takes 19 days to repair and then gets shipped from Germany...if you can prove even a couple of days as a result of the other stuff you hit the magical 30 day threshold.

The OP is incurring material damage as a direct result of BMW's incompetency. He is paying a BMW payment for a Hyundai and has been out of his car for FIVE MONTHS because of their screwups. Whether BMW likes it or not the OP can 100% lemon law the car in Ohio. Not sure where the OP lives.

Alternately, if he wants to keep the car BMW will almost certainly reimburse him for the difference in payments. This happened to me as well.

[Black Flagged]

Originally Posted by paradoxical3

It's a goodwill process by BMW that is designed to get people out of cars that have been in the shop excessively long. Now there are a couple of caveats to that. First, they are much more likely to do something if you're past the official lemon law standards in your state. They lose more money if you lemon law it legally so they basically take care of you to avoid that process. In ohio the lemon law says

"In the first year or first 18,000 miles, whichever occurs first:
• Have three or more attempts been made to repair one problem and then the problem either continues to exist or occurs again?
• Has the vehicle been in the shop for a cumulative total of 30 days or more during its first year or 18,000 miles, whichever occurs first?
• Have eight or more attempts been made to fix different problems?
• Has one unsuccessful attempt been made to fix a problem that could cause death or serious injury?"

In the OP's case they will push back because the original reason for being in the shop was not BMW's fault. However, they should be liable for the parts delays as well as the faulty welding. If those days add up to over 30 days in the shop than the OP probably has grounds for a lemon law buyback. Further, BMW has precedent for doing trade assists as a result of parts availability - when the 335 HPFPs were failing and there was a several month delay, several forum members got a trade assist. You shouldn't be paying for a BMW for months and driving a Hyundai as a result of BMW's failure to procure parts to repair your car in a timely manner. At this point that's what I'd pursue especially because of the lost value to the car.

If the dealership and BMW NA don't want to play ball I'd get a lemon law attorney. They work for free and get paid by the manufacturer after they win. $100 says once they get the letter informing them that you've aligned yourself with a lemon law lawyer they play ball with the trade assist.

thanks, i should of used this program with my E90... had nothing but problems with this car and i did lose value with it when i traded it in

[paradoxical3]

Originally Posted by Gangsta D

thanks, i should of used this program with my E90... had nothing but problems with this car and i did lose value with it when i traded it in

As I said though it depends on the lemon laws in your state. Ohio has pretty good ones but some states don't. There is no motivation from BMW to help you with a trade assist of your car is not legally lemon-able. If you do a lemon law legally BMW has to formally put the lemon tag on the vehicle, which craters its resale value.

If you do a trade assist, BMW does not have to sell the car as a lemon.

So it's a win-win process, but you have to convince them you are willing to lemon the car before it's offered (I was).

[Black Flagged]

Originally Posted by paradoxical3

As I said though it depends on the lemon laws in your state. Ohio has pretty good ones but some states don't. There is no motivation from BMW to help you with a trade assist of your car is not legally lemon-able. If you do a lemon law legally BMW has to formally put the lemon tag on the vehicle, which craters its resale value.

If you do a trade assist, BMW does not have to sell the car as a lemon.

So it's a win-win process, but you have to convince them you are willing to lemon the car before it's offered (I was).

i had 335I also and it had HPFP problems at least 10 times on me. drove me crazy, if it was not for the dealership taking care of the problem every time i would not be a fan of BMW today. then came a recall so BMW could keep from getting sued from everyone with this problem. it was the first bimmer i traded in and lost value on it because of all the problem that occured with the N54, if i knew of that trade assist i surly would have used it before that recall. thanks

[CIWS]

Well that certainly sucks. Hope you can get a satisfactory resolution to the issue.

Body parts seems to be a time problem for the X1 if it's taken decent damage, could be for some other models as well.

I'd be very surprised if you could use a lemon law for an accident repair. The problem wouldn't be BMWs, it would be a body shop / dealership's issue and they're generally notorious for being difficult to replace cars since it's the dealership who has to absorb the cost, not BMW USA. Just look at the multiple instances where maintenance people crash owners cars that are in to be repaired and owners try to get the dealership to replace the vehicle.

Not saying don't try to get the dealership to do it. If anything they might swap you out then sell that one to some unsuspecting owner off their pre-owned lot.

[Gort]

[MrSnrub]

Thanks everybody. Nothing positive to report. The shop and the dealer are each telling me the other can help me out. BMW NA was infuriatingly useless.

My reading would suggest that the lemon law might apply by virtue of the third (of three) qualifying criteria, but it wouldn't be an open-shut case. I could try the Magnusson-Moss Warranty act but my lawyer-of-a-wife doesn't think it'd be smooth. It would also require the expense of retaining a lawyer.

I don't want to screw these guys, I just want my car back and a few months of lease payments returned to me.

[paradoxical3]

How are you contacting BMW NA? That's what got the ball rolling for me.