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      07-19-2015, 07:25 PM   #23
paradoxical3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucky13 View Post
0-60 is still 6.3 seconds, do some actual research instead of BS.
6.3 is really slow compared to the last X1. My X1 was stock at 5.3 seconds, and with a few hundred bucks in mods dips below 4 seconds.

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Dude, do yourself a favor and Google "what's wrong with Cadillac or Cadillac ATS/CTS "and you will see you are in a ultra small minority of opinion. Cadillac is so fucked up they can stick a fork in them.
I googled and all I am seeing is reviews saying the ATS is the best driving car in the segment?

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Oh and all X1 drivers are 70 year old women, I see X1's every day and the vast majority are driven by people in their 20's and 30's and a mix of men/women. I have never ever seen someone in their 70's driving an X1.
Not sure what you are trying to say here. Each of your three sentences disproves the others. Your first statement says that all X1 drivers are 70 year old women. In your second sentence you directly contradict that by saying that the majority of them are driven by men and women in their 20s and 30s, and then in your final sentence you state that you have never seen someone in their 70s driving a X1. You are a mess!

Also, I am not sure why you are even here arguing in the X1 forum if you don't own one. There is no need for insults about our cars. I would never insult your M235i even though it is significantly, significantly slower than my X1 on the drag strip and on the road course.


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Yes and if you took the best interior of blah , and best engine of blah, and best ride of blah etc etc, that's the whole point, BMW does them all well and that's why they win.
But they are not winning current comparisons. That is my entire point. You will need to provide some proof if you say they are. I have already referenced several reviews where they lose.

I would really like to hear your arguments once you can formulate a complete sentence. Until then, it is really hard to understand what you are trying to say.
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      07-20-2015, 01:03 PM   #24
zero-2-sixty
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucky13 View Post
M235 Car and Driver top 10 and Motor Trend top 10.
yes, that's nice but what say you regarding the 3 series.....not on 10 Best list. Paradoxical is right when he alludes to BMW is not building cars for purists thses days. its 60% luxury/practicality and 40% performance. New X1 has no 6cyl, no hydraulic steering for superior road feel, no rear biased AWD, no low center of gravity. These are not what the brands new customer base value now. these things are important to purist performance customer but not the majority of BMW's customers
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      07-20-2015, 08:55 PM   #25
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I think everyone is right in some ways. The old X1 we all have drove great but suffered from relatively horrible packaging. The new one fixes that but gives away a lot of driving enjoyment.

What I think paradox is missing is that kids these days don't aspire to driving fun to drive cars or really any cars at all. Maybe BMW saw the writing on the wall and decided to sell to the market as it will exist in 10 years not as it existed 20 years ago. I suspect the X1 will sell better than ever and more to the market BMW actually wants. They never wanted the X1 to be sold to enthusiasts and sales would have been stronger if they were more practical since they are competing in a market of practical cars.

Is it a loss for people who appreciate the old school BMW feel? Absolutely, but for every one of us, there are 3 people who don't care about that but do want a car that looks better and can actually fit their family.

BMW is dead, long live BMW.
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      07-21-2015, 07:00 AM   #26
zero-2-sixty
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CVX1 View Post
I think everyone is right in some ways. The old X1 we all have drove great but suffered from relatively horrible packaging. The new one fixes that but gives away a lot of driving enjoyment.

What I think paradox is missing is that kids these days don't aspire to driving fun to drive cars or really any cars at all. Maybe BMW saw the writing on the wall and decided to sell to the market as it will exist in 10 years not as it existed 20 years ago. I suspect the X1 will sell better than ever and more to the market BMW actually wants. They never wanted the X1 to be sold to enthusiasts and sales would have been stronger if they were more practical since they are competing in a market of practical cars.

Is it a loss for people who appreciate the old school BMW feel? Absolutely, but for every one of us, there are 3 people who don't care about that but do want a car that looks better and can actually fit their family.

BMW is dead, long live BMW.
The target market for the X1 is no longer the performance / purist crowd. BMW is aiming for high volume sales. this segment is tough competition as there are now many subcompact/compact crossover offerings in this class vying for the consumers dollar. most consumers value efficient packaging, some luxury, safety, good road manners not a canyon carving, apex predator that we performance crowd want the X1 to be. We don't have to like it but that is the way it is going to be for the foreseeable future. look to the Porsche Macan as an alternative.
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      07-21-2015, 09:16 PM   #27
atomic
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zero-2-sixty View Post
yes, that's nice but what say you regarding the 3 series.....not on 10 Best list. Paradoxical is right when he alludes to BMW is not building cars for purists thses days. its 60% luxury/practicality and 40% performance. New X1 has no 6cyl, no hydraulic steering for superior road feel, no rear biased AWD, no low center of gravity. These are not what the brands new customer base value now. these things are important to purist performance customer but not the majority of BMW's customers
The six cylinder argument is weak in my opinion. They don't offer the X1 in a six outside of North America. It sells better in other markets. The 4 in the X1 has a lot more power than the six in my previous BMW. I would consider the engine in my X11 a performance engine. Many the 6 cylinder was not a big seller on a car that wasn't a big seller in the US.
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      07-21-2015, 09:29 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxical3 View Post
The new X1 is not getting the 2.0 in 240hp trim, and the opinions I am quoting are not mine, but rather those of Car and Driver - their opinions have a huge weight to the general public. The new X1 is:

1. Less powerful than the old one in every single trim
2. Takes away hydraulic steering and replaces it with the electric rack that is getting panned
3. Replaces a RWD biased drivetrain with a FWD biased one
4. Grows in ride height
5. Moves from the award winning e9x chassis to a new tranverse drivetrain FWD based chassis.

Are you really trying to argue that it even has a chance of driving in an equivalently fun manner to the previous X1?
The general public does not read Car and Driver.

The increased ride height is good. They are selling as SUV so it should be able to handle some off road stuff.

I would wait to drive the new X1 before making an opinion on the vehicle.

The 4 in my X1 has ton of power the six really has no purpose on American roads with speed limits no higher than 75. If you want a six and a lower ride height I suggest you buy a car instead of SUV or keep your Current X1. Obviously you are not the target demographic for the new X1. Just because it doesn't fit you doesn't mean it won't sell a lot more vehicles.
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      07-22-2015, 01:30 AM   #29
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My situation might not be typical: Bought the X1 because I needed a practical/economical vehicle for driving my kids to school (100 miles a day!). Never expected the car to be such a blast to drive and for a 4-cylinder to have such power!
Now I've been bitten by the performance bug and refuse to compromise and accept less power in the new iteration.
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      07-22-2015, 07:46 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atomic View Post

The 4 in my X1 has ton of power the six really has no purpose on American roads with speed limits no higher than 75.
This statement makes no sense. So your 240 is great, but 300 is useless?

With AWD, you can easily make use of 3-400 HP in the 0-80 MPH range people tend to drive in. Let alone that not everyone drives 75, and passing/merging power is a big luxury.

It would take about 100 HP to make an X1 do 75. Are you suggesting they should have given it only that much? You know, because anything more would have "no purpose".

I will say, that with the 8 speed, the 4 banger is the better choice for most buyers vs. the N55. But that doesn't mean you should discredit the 6 for those that enjoy the performance (and aftermarket potential). My wifes' X1 makes about 380hp, and she still asks for more.

PS, the 4 in your X1 has nothing even remotely resembling "tons" of power. It's a great base engine, and certainly powerful enough to make the car fun. But you have less power than a V6 Camry or RAV4. 240 hasn't been "tons" of power" in over a decade.

Last edited by PrematureApex; 07-22-2015 at 08:00 AM..
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      07-22-2015, 07:56 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atomic View Post
They don't offer the X1 in a six outside of North America.
Much of that has to do with gas prices...and the fact that we don't get a 335 touring here.


Quote:
Originally Posted by atomic View Post
The 4 in the X1 has a lot more power than the six in my previous BMW.
This is relevant how? Your 4 never had more power than the "big" or upgraded 6 offered in any line in recent years, only the base 6 which the 4 replaced.

Quote:
Originally Posted by atomic View Post
I would consider the engine in my X11 a performance engine.
It's a base engine. It's a very good base engine, but hardly intended to be a "performance engine" if you're being honest. If you consider 240 HP in a 3700 lb car performance...well...you've set the bar low. 240 HP is pedestrian.

All that being said, sure, there's little reason to offer a turbo 6 in the X1. It was pretty cool that BMW tossed us a bone with the E84...albeit with the wrong transmission(s). It was a quirky/fun combination that I know many enthusiasts enjoyed.

Anyway, with the transverse engine, any new performance X1 will have to have a high-output 4 anyway.

And there's still hope for the 335 touring...fingers crossed.

Last edited by PrematureApex; 07-22-2015 at 08:06 AM..
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      07-22-2015, 10:19 AM   #32
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Build Your Own is up on the US demo site!

http://demo1.bmwusa.com/standard/con...modelcode=16XB
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      07-22-2015, 10:19 AM   #33
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Re: 6cyl - not a weak argument

Quote:
Originally Posted by atomic View Post
The six cylinder argument is weak in my opinion. They don't offer the X1 in a six outside of North America. It sells better in other markets. The 4 in the X1 has a lot more power than the six in my previous BMW. I would consider the engine in my X11 a performance engine. Many the 6 cylinder was not a big seller on a car that wasn't a big seller in the US.
My point was that the 6cyl was a performance option for enthusiasts that like more power...btw, your point about the power comparison is useless apples to oranges comparison. Oh and most new premium turbo 4cyl have more power than older generation 6cyl. The N55 is a great engine to tune? Now to your only valid point - the 6cyl option did not sell well. You are correct and I understand why BMW stopped selling it...then again BMW's 8cyl offerings are not huge sellers and they remainin the same line up. I see many more 528i and 535i than 550i on the road. Had this new X1 remained Rwd configuration, it stands to reason that the 6cyl may (emphasis added) still have been offered. Look....just enjoy your X1 and if you don't like it sell it and indulge in new FWD based model. I will not as the target market for the new X1 has changed. I will scope a Porsche Macan S or VW Golf R (if I want a hatch)
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      07-22-2015, 10:29 AM   #34
zero-2-sixty
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E84

Quote:
Originally Posted by PrematureApex View Post

All that being said, sure, there's little reason to offer a turbo 6 in the X1. It was pretty cool that BMW tossed us a bone with the E84...albeit with the wrong transmission(s). It was a quirky/fun combination that I know many enthusiasts enjoyed.

Anyway, with the transverse engine, any new performance X1 will have to have a high-output 4 anyway.
Yes, it was the E84's identity crisis (is it a wagon, suv), uniqueness, power (6cy trim), road feel, and fun that drew me to the vehicle. I do plan to test drive the new one, but my expectations are low (from a performance enthusiast's perspective). I think the X2 will have a hi-po 4 cyl.
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      07-22-2015, 10:30 AM   #35
paradoxical3
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The new X1 is too slow for my tastes, so in order to make it faster I am putting a 550whp Pure Turbo in my e84 x1. That way I can tow the new X1 behind it, which is the only way the new one will have reasonable performance.
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      07-22-2015, 10:37 AM   #36
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Nice

Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxical3 View Post
I am putting a 550whp Pure Turbo stage 2 in my e84 X1 to celebrate the new one's boringness.

0-60 in 3.2 seconds...while towing the new X1
Too funny
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      07-26-2015, 03:20 AM   #37
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I bought my X1 for all the reasons said that no one buys N55 X1's.

Having driven a 28i, I find them rather soulless and pedestrian. They are perfectly adequate transportation, but nowhere near as fun as the 35i.

I like the 6 speed actually. The 8 speed in the 28i I drove wasn't that awesome IMHO. Maybe I am missing something. Maybe it was the tune? It was rather sluggish in shifting. And the Alpina flash makes our 6 speed sing.

Gas mileage doesn't seem much to write home about in the 28i either. My 35i is getting around 22.8 in mixed city 70%/Hwy 30% driving now. I drive fairly normally but I do romp on it quite a bit as it is a kick in the balls. Especially to a-hole drivers in their Camaro's...or whatever...

Now I am sure I will hear all about how someone knows a guys, uncles, sisters, brother in law is getting 68 MPG in their 28i. But I am sticking to my experience. I have a record of every fillup so far.

I am hitting the BMW driving experience here on Monday. Doing some autocrossing. Maybe they will have the new X1 out there. I will report back.

I am also hitting the M experience dinner on Tuesday night. Mmmmmm, all the M's I can eat....sweet....
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      08-13-2015, 09:27 PM   #38
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BMW have it right, yeah enthusiasts are gonna be pissed but the current X1 is crazy small inside and the ride and refinement are agricultural at best, absolute shite refinement TBH.

BMW went soft and sell bazillons of 3-series, Cadillac went all har dcore and couldn't sell to their own mother.

Hate to say it but BMW saw it coming.
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      08-14-2015, 12:54 AM   #39
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Reply to 2016 X1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfisti View Post
BMW have it right, yeah enthusiasts are gonna be pissed but the current X1 is crazy small inside and the ride and refinement are agricultural at best, absolute shite refinement TBH.

BMW went soft and sell bazillons of 3-series, Cadillac went all har dcore and couldn't sell to their own mother.

Hate to say it but BMW saw it coming.
Yes, we all know the E84 is the black sheep of BMW's current crop of SAVs. Smallish inside, no electric steering in xdrive models (yes, there are customers who could care less about feedback that hydraulic setups provide). But the current gen X1 is unique and performance oriented - that's its charm is its classic BMW of yore. Not new gen BMW.

Yes, the new one will sell many more and be a high volume entry Crossover for BMW, but that doesn't mean we performance junkies have to like it and more importantly --- we don't have to buy/lease it. We'll just complain and move to something else. Maybe the gurus at BMW will throw we subcompact SAV performance buyers a bone in the future.
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      08-14-2015, 08:11 AM   #40
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That's the thing, something else, as in what? There's nothing really like it, TBH Mini would be closest.
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      08-14-2015, 08:18 AM   #41
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Golf R.
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      08-14-2015, 12:31 PM   #42
zero-2-sixty
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Quote:
Originally Posted by improvius View Post
Golf R.
that is a nice alternative. but it is not a small crossover SUV. I am thinking a macan S.
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      08-14-2015, 12:32 PM   #43
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I also thought about Golf R as a replacement of my X1 few years later. Just wonder if the size of the trunk is comparable. The trunk space on X1 is enough for me.
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      08-14-2015, 12:40 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfisti View Post
That's the thing, something else, as in what? There's nothing really like it, TBH Mini would be closest.
our only hope would be for folks in Munich to configure the upcoming X2 so that it can accommodate the B58 engine with 8sp transmission and provide rear bias AWD. I hope the platform is modular to permit the above changes. I can give up the hydraulic steering to get the above. otherwise its X3 35i or leave BMW for another brand like VW Golf / Porsche Macan S.
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